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Responses to my question: Why should I believe in god?: Thanks for raising this topic. Definitely
an interesting mental/philosophical exercise.
Therefore, while many (or most) people
believe the only way to deal with the question of God is through
science it certainly seems absurd for those same people to use science
as an absolute denial of God s existence when they are still incapable
of using science to prove the known scientific facts we already are aware of.
Namely, this universe exists. It is made of matter. It has life. But Science
still can't tell us how it happened. Where it came from? And even though some
of our scientific THEORIES have sound logic, none of them explain
SCIENTIFICALLY how the origin of the universe happened. I
hope your name is Mike Anyway, Mike , I have a few
theories on Religion .church, GOD I was raised in Southern
Louisiana, and have attended many of the Catholic schools in the area ..I
have found no God in my search. I have found many, many, money grubbing pricks
(hiding behind the Church for Tax reasons) but no God .Maybe we were put
here by a higher race of beings Yes I said
it Aliens .ET .I think that maybe we were a science
project or maybe a bet or wager of some sort .Follow me with
this I know it s out there, but just follow me OK! Let s
just say, that there are Four, maybe five Aliens, in a space ship. They all are
sitting around a monitor, looking at this planet. It s a good one, just
like they were looking for It s at the ass end of the known
universe, but close enough to were they can check on it if they wanted
to (All of the UFO sittings) Anyway,
Now we
all know that We come from the same material right. Carbon, nitrogen,
water ect .What if these building blocks were
unilateral for all life everywhere .That would change a few
things but still believable .Ok back to the story. So, they are
sitting there knowing that they have the right building
blocks the right planet, with lots of water, and good
temperature ect. They know that this will produce life .the only
thing that would dictate how this life would end up, would be the special
circumstances of this particular planet . That
would make sense. What
if they had a wager what if they waited long enough to let the
concoction of DNA and what not, simmer on this backward ass
planet long enough to produce bi-pedal creatures capable of
communication what if there was a wager, to see who could get the
whole planet s population of wild bipedal, communicating MONKEYS to
worship them as a god even thought there parents would not
approve .. That
would definitely change a few things around .I am not saying that
this is the truth .I am just saying that it is just as believable as
saying that GOD did this I have never met him,
don t plan on it, If it happens, then great, but I for one cannot put any
faith in to that Know what I mean? You have all of these
people running around with all of these different religions what the hell
is that about. If there is one God, then that would mean that there should only
be one religion right ..and this Jesus fellow. He probably did walk
the Earth at one time He probably was a KEWL
dude ..The son of God? Well, that remains to be seen .He, in my
eyes, was the first Hippie .he was the first person to stand up and
say . Hey, wait a minute .This is fucked up!!!!!!! and
then, you get all of these people after him saying how cool he was for saving
all the Jews. and what not From
what I have learned ..Religion was introduced the masses
to calm them. We were a bunch of wild animals running around killing one
another (just like we still do). So somebody, and that somebody was a
genius, even by today s standards. He Stood up and said God will
be mad at you if you do that. Tell me this. Why do we think we are so High And
Mighty with our religion here in the states. When across the globe, you have
religions that are 10,000 years older than our own ..Are we
right ? I don t know, but it doesn t look good does it.
I m just wondering how long we are going to keep our heads in the sand
about this issue we definitely need some closure on the subject, although
it would do us any good. Because most of the people would call you a blasphemer
if you say anything that contradicts what they preach ..Just like when
they used to cut your head off when you said that the world was round and not
flat. Know what I mean. Religion was a good idea when they thought about it, but
it sure has back fired.
Now you have Non-communicating monkeys killing one another for
religion .That is something that I NEVER understood. Collin Williams Mike Now I'm not gonna be able to answer any of your questions but I
saw your I guess this guy is talking to Sugar Queen and not me. Mike Hey Mike, as a "militant Emporial Agnostic" (I strongly believe in God and strongly believe that we're all wrong, especcially ALL religions and belief systems) your question about God piqued my interest. I wanted to answer your questions, but I didn't know how to say what I wanted to say, or even what I wanted to say, until I read Sugar Queen's message, and now I've thought of a few things to say in the manner of commenting on what she had to say. Maybe this will give my take on your question, or start a topic of discussion, or just waste all of our time... which theology and philosiphy usually do. >> For a long time I was sceptical<< Were you also skeptical? Ok, ok, that was irrelevant, and it was a cheap shot, and it was hypocritical because I have typos all the time, but I had to ;) Ok, that was just plain rude of me. But, I'm an asshole, I had to. Moving on: >> of a creator<< In my opinion "God" as we think of it didn't/doesn't neccesarily have to create anything, s/he could have just came along and taken control of whatever there was already made my something else and made it better, like Henry Ford didn't invent the automobile, he just started mass production and made it better. In my opinion though it's likely that whatever supernatural force is out there that's holding everything together and all that probably made the earth and atleast controls evolution, and some trivial events in our life, but I think that "God" is letting fate play itself out, and maybe s/he is somewhat in control but not total control of our lives/fate/destiny. Maybe it's something like the game "The Sims"??? >>but for now I am positive there was one.<< As much evidence as I see or as strongly as I believe in God I don't think that I could ever be 100% certain in the existance of God simply because there is always the possibility that there isn't. >>Order can not come from chaos. Before there was the universe there was chaos.... in no way could order come from chaos.<< If you had enough monkeys pounding away on typewriters, eventually one would write a shakespeare. There's been billions of years of chaos and it is quite possible that eventually everything lined up just perfectly for life to take place on it's own, but I agree that it's not very likely that it happened without some higher force guiding it. >>People say the big bang started it all.<< Other people say Jesus started it all, or Allah. Some people say thawing ice, static spark, or magnetism started it all. There's way too many theories. The Big Bang is the one that most Christians like to emphasize because it's the easiest for them to attack, so it's the one that gets all the attention. >>Take a deck of cards for example and shuffle them.
No matter how many times you shuffle them the cards will never be in order Actually, it will. 1 out of every 52! (factorial of 52, ...52x51x50x49x48x47... etc. it's a BIG number) times for a deck of 52 (with no Jokers) and 1 out of every 54! (again, factorial, it's 2,862 (54x53) times bigger than 52!) times for a deck of 54 (with the jokers). If I sat here and shuffled cards for a billion years, eventually they would come back into order. (Or I could get lucky and it could happen the second time that I shuffled the deck. >>You simply cannot have order from the chaos you created. Someone has to go in there and put order.<< Anything's possible. It's just easier for our incoherent
minds to comprehend if we create something in our imagination to give credit to.
It's just hard for many people to admit that we really have no clue what the
truth is. Or atleast there was a designer at one point (again, I
reiterate, I DO beleive in the current existance of a creator God!) but, as a
mechanic, I've seen parts come out of cars with wear marks in them that are some
pretty intricate designs, but noone designed them. They were a direct result of
chaos. Multiplie that chaos by billions of years and anything is possible,
especcially when you throw in the factor of survival of the most adapt. But I do
however agree, everything in life is so intricate, and so well designed that
there has to be a God. One of the times that I was most convinced of the
existance of a deity was the first time that I visited the Grand Canyon. Not
specifically because of the intricity of the Grand Canyon, but just because it
got me thinking of all this shit. Well, it started out as a very simple chemical called a protein... Seriously though, yeah, I agree with you. What happened is more of a question of "How did our creator do it" rather than "what made us how we are". >> After millions of years of nothing happening something had to cause it.<< It was a couple billion years, and stuff happened, it was just
on the atomic level so noone noticed. Anyone that's ever ran a website
understands exponential growth. You start out with 1 hit every other day.
After a while you're getting 2 hits every couple days (or whatever the
statistics are) which is hardly a noticeable difference. But those two
people tell two people each, and all of a sudden you have 6 people visiting.
They tell two people each and you have 18 people visiting. When the #s get
bigger you have a more substantial and more noticable difference. The
growth and development in the first few billion years was far too small for us
to notice, especcially when we're looking back at it billions of years later
trying to trace the steps out of the ground from evidence that's nearly
destroyed. I agree with you wholeheartedly. It's unlikely that all
this complicated orginization came from chaos, but my point is that it's still
possible. Nice site ;) Wish that I could make a site with a decent looking layout... heh. You should enable comments though. Take advantage of having GreyMatter on your stie. Anyway, as for Mike's questions... >>If God knows what happens in the future... why does he/she/it go through this whole universe and life cycle? Why? << God might not know, like I said, it could be like the video game
"The Sims" for "God" or maybe S/He does know the outcome and
has created life with a specific lesson for each of us to learn from going
through it, sort of a like how the army knows the outcome of sending their >>God knows the outcome right?<< Maybe, maybe not. >>If God built this universe... << Maybe S/He did, maybe S/He found this existing universe and took control of it. >>Then how in the fuck did God become? Who made him? How did God suddenly appear?<< Maybe his/her parents, or another God. Or maybe there is a committee of people in charge of our destinies, or maybe this life is like the "holadeck" on Star Trek, where we voluntarily entered life for something entertaining to do and it's all just for fun and everything's just pretend, and everything that we see is a hologram, and everything that we smell, feel, taste or hear is just a programmed virtual reallity created by this video game that we're playing. Maybe noone exists and I'm just dreaming or imagining all of this. As for WHY you should believe in God, you shouldn't, unless you do. There is no reason to believe in God other than that you do believe in God. Christians make up all sorts of rationalizations to justify their viewpoint that if you don't believe their religion you'll burn in hell for eternity (so that they can gain mind control over you) and the root of their religion is a belief in God, so they have the entire world thinking that there are reasons why you NEED to believe in God. They even use the term "atheist" in a derogatory manner, and use the term "faith" to make "believers" seem like a better type of person than "non-believers". There's so much factioning within belief systems, even as to the very nature of this God that everyone says that we have to believe in. On a personal note, I WAS a very devout Mormon for several years, and when I went into the temple to do my endowments, I felt the presence of God very strongly and I am pretty sure that either The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints puts LSD in the temple clothing or hallucenagenic gases in the air conditioning in their temples, or there is a God. As a part of the endowment procedure I made a commitment to God that I would never discuss what went on in the temple, and I will keep that promise because it was a very personal experience where I felt very close to God and I am fairly sure of the existance of a higher power, but from latter experiences in my life and having studied Christian history, doctrine and theology and "The Holy Bible", I can very strongly say that I KNOW that there is extremely little chance that ANY religion is true (including Mormonism (LDS)). All religions are BULLSHIT in MY opinion. ESPECCIALLY Christianity and all of it's denominations. "The most important, life-changing information that I know of is the knowledge that we are truly children of God our Eternal Father." Elder M. Russell Ballard of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, Ensign, May 1999, 86 Personally, I've never once seen the belief in God change the life of anyone directly that wasn't changing their life on their own already... except for justifying the hatred and bigotry of racist Christians in the KKK. When I take a good, objective look at it, I think that the reason that I believe in "God" is simply to put my mind at ease. I watched a Shirley Temple (I think) movie once where these people lived in Heaven, and then came to Earth to live life and then went back to Heaven after they died, and they wanted to be born on Earth to experience life. This is very similar to Mormon doctrine and is very similar to how I look at life, which is probably the biggest reason that I became a Mormon in the first place (besides the fact that I was a devout Christian and at the time didn't drink, smoke, do drugs or have sex and couldn't find any other Christians with the same "moral" values). Anyway, I'm sure nothing that I said was of any use... oh well ;)
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